At Anime Matsuri, Matthew Mercer, the voice of Tygra on the new Thundercats cartoon, held a panel. In it he candidly discussed where the series stands and how it’s doing. Here are some bullet points from the panel, courtesy of LioConvoy at the Thundercats Lair Forums:
• Cartoon Network is supposedly skeptical about doing Season 2
• Season 2 (second 26 episodes) have been ordered, but not yet produced
• Toys were not selling well to kids
• Thundercats moved to Saturdays to draw more kids in to buy the toys and watch the show
• Cartoon ratings have at least doubled since move to Saturday mornings
• He said watching it legally, and buying the merchandise is best way to support the franchise
- Tygra
Someone at TCL said they spoke with Matthew Mercer at Anime Matsuri and he said the next 26 episodes were ordered but not produced yet.
I saw Matthew Mercer this weekend. Got to ask him about Thundercat rumors. - ThunderCats Lair Message Boards/Forums
Moved to it's own thread so it doesn't get lost in the shuffle. Also, thank you for sharing the link.
I'd buy the toys if I can actually find a 6 inch Tygra...dang it! Everywhere I look its NOT available!
What they should sell are baby Lion-O and Tygra plushies....and a 6 foot version of Tygra, Lion-O and Cheetara. THAT would sell faster than anything on black friday, lol
Here's a thought, if they want more kids to watch, why don't they just put more action into the show. I love a good story, but this show moves extremely slow compared to the original. Thundercats are supposed to be fast paced and loud, not slow moving and meek.
Buying Tygra was a bad idea, for I couldn't get Cheetara. It shouldn't be so difficult to find the toys. Without any other ThunderCat in the household he spends his days with his Barbie harem...
Plushies FTW!
I record the show because I work most Saturdays, hopefully that's good enough. It sucks because with all the cable boxes and modern technologies, we're still under the mercy of the Nielsen ratings.
Also I don't buy the merchandise because I don't like the way the most of them look. I can't support a toy line that doesn't support my tastes. The designs on the shows are so great but the toys are lackluster for an adult collector like me. But hopefully the younger Saturday morning viewers will get into it and start buying the figures.
Well I cannot watch it any other way then illegally if that is even the word CN here doesn't transmit the show here I guess I could buy the episodes online somehow or the DVD but for the last one I would have to wait too long besides I'm buying the toys at least the ones they made good
I would love to buy the toys, unfortunately I just don't have room in the apartment I share and there are prohibitive costs as well. You can bet I'll be buying the hell out of the DVD's, and maybe if they make a Pumyra figure I'll pick up one of her and maybe Lion-O. She's definitely the gateway toy for me though, unless I can find them super cheap.
I'm in a similar situation as Grippen. The only way I get to see any episodes is off the internet, and not shown in canada.
I'd buy the toys if they were articulated well and painted right. I went to look at some in the packages at walmart but they looked weird. Are the trading cards still continuing?
I own all of the figures already, the classic lion o, mumra, the tank , a black TC tshirt,
in texas 
I watch the show every sat morning,
Im waiting..
For a cat's lair playset, (tower of omens) was stupid, so i didnt get that.
Also i want a TC ps3 game.
And hope for a blueray collection of these shows some day
But i guess nomatter how much 1 person can own may not be enough.
Whoever is looking for the classic lion o, mumra and tygra, my walmart is loaded with them
It's interesting that some of you have taken this personally as if somehow you're responsible for the lackluster performance of the Thundercats brand! CN and Bandai completely f'd up this license! It was their damned fault that the toy line did not sell to kids! Friday nights?!? Long periods of absence with no news as to the show's return to TV, horrible case packs, bizarre distribution, and no TV toy commercials? What did they expect? That Mercer guy should kiss each and every one of our asses for keeping interest in Thundercats alive so he can his job!
I have to agree with some of your points there and add a few. Thundercats was such a global icon that I ask why wasn't this brodcasted worldwide just like the 80s one. And at that time we should be honest there wasn't so many cartoons as the kids have now. Probably if they had released them a bit more global they could have made a few more bucks. Personally I'm loving the series really waiting for the next episode every single week. Bought the first UK magazine and also liked it and even liked the preview of the US comic (wonder where that is now another good job from Bandai). So resuming I like this new modern concept of the figures and story just hope they do at least one more season.
As for the toys well my personal opinion is that they should stick to what they did more or less Ok which was the 6'' line. Tygra and Cheetara are very good figures, Tygra is an awesome figure I'm one of the lucky ones that got him just wish more people had him its a wonderfull figure. Quit the 4'' and do one more wave of 6'' with the twins packed with a new Snarf or even the one from the Thundertank, and Pumyra or Grun or even both so 3 figures. Even sales are good continue if not drop them also.
For me DVD is really the only legit way to watch it. But I can't find anything but the pilot in stores. I'll have to check and see what I can find online.
Not too interested in toys, but I might get Mumm-Ra in his normal form to stick on my computer.
I have to agree with "Covenant"
For most of us who know what thundercats is/are, Its easy to spot these in stores or online, But for the new generation of kids who never heard of such, will be lost or confused.
Bandi failed to put the product out there. Back in the days, TCs was all over the map. Now it seems like only few countries get the show, toys or any news.
If you wanna sell. be heard or seen, you need to put ur stuff out there for EVERYBODY to see/hear.
Worldwide , every country should see the show, every country should get the same things, even if most get sumthing diff from others but atleast their stuff is seen.
I dont remember seeing 1 damn (toy)commercial. Then their shows are cutt off for a few weeks, even months b4 we see it again on tv. The toys are 50/50. could b better or well made,
Lets not forget they cancled the 8line or watever? How does this help their fanbase?
Then at toyfair, they dont give us anything new.
So yea If bandi doesnt wanna put effort into this then let another brand do it. At least we'll know the new company will put heart into it for the show/product(s) as well as the fans.
The show is not even available in Canada yet and only the 2 eight inch and the first wave of the 6 inch have even hit our shelves. I have never seen a toy commercial for the line and I think that the toys are horrible. Why would they go with bandi??? they suck. The articulation is very lacking, paint apps are piss poor, stupid magnet gimmick ruined Wiley Kit and Kat, very slow on the new figure release and the show is good for an adult ie has a great story but there is not enough action at all...kids are not watching it. I have to download it and neither of my nephews like it at all...they think its boring so they watch the original that airs on teletoon retro up here in Canada. The whole Thundercats franchise has been mismanaged and whoever is in charge should be let go.
I actually have seen commercials for the toys, but pretty much ONLY on CN and I haven't seen them in quite a few months.
Big fan base around the world
Get the toys and the cartoon out there---people want to see it!
Since the toys are on clearance, I need to get Tygra, the twins, and Mumm-Ra to complete the first wave.
I think, as some others have said, one of the main problems is the lack of action. And a case-in-point example of this is the lack of 'thundercats HO!' in the show. I get that you don't want stock animation, but guess what? Most kids don't care. They freaking love transformation/power-up sequences. DBZ's entire popularity is based around really long power-up sequences, as is Digimon, Power Rangers and anything related, and so on.
The show doesn't even have very good fights compared to numerous other cartoons on right now (Young Justice, Green Lantern, Korra, etc.) It needs to step it up in the action department.
As for the show and toys worldwide I agree and I cannot understand how for DBZ a disaster of movie they release the silly toys here and for this nothing. At leas they could have released the toys here who knows what would happen. But its weird how CN is almost everywhere and they don't broadcast it. Different from other lines this was easy. For example TFs prime is not in a global channel at least we don't have it here still I've seen toys in shelves in a considerable amount. WB should have demanded a worldwide spread of the line, toys and cartoons.
People can't watch it legally when CN does not stream the show online. It's kinda hard to watch something that isn't there.
Anyway, the toys don't sell because Bandai has done nothing to advertise them. Bandai only releases them because they were given the license, but they don't give a damn about it. If they cared, they would take pride in the line and try to sell it like crazy. Plus, in order to get the toys to sell, you have to release new figures every 3 months, NOT do figures, 6 months later release a couple more, and then nothing for 8 months.
Also, since when does a toy line need to sell for the show to continue? Johnny Test doesn't have a toyline and it is on CN 60 times a day. Samurai Jack and Transformers Animated had toylines and they were still canned.
Different shows have different needs. With Thundercats, I'm guessing, merchandising profits from toys and other licensed products were built into the production budget, especially considering the lengthy and costly process of wrestling the brand away from Rankin Bass. If the sales of toys and licensed products aren't producing enough revenue, that can result in the show being less profitable than they had planned and budgeted for.
WB thought they had an absolute slam dunk here with the adult fans and a "new" property for kids to be roped in. Unfortunately, neither wound up really being the case here for various reasons mentioned in numerous posts above.
Anyway, the toys don't sell because Bandai has done nothing to advertise them. Bandai only releases them because they were given the license, but they don't give a damn about it. If they cared, they would take pride in the line and try to sell it like crazy. Plus, in order to get the toys to sell, you have to release new figures every 3 months, NOT do figures, 6 months later release a couple more, and then nothing for 8 months.
Also, since when does a toy line need to sell for the show to continue? Johnny Test doesn't have a toyline and it is on CN 60 times a day. Samurai Jack and Transformers Animated had toylines and they were still canned.
It's true that shows can survive without a toyline to support it, but for action properties like Thundercats it's difficult though not impossible (Avatar managed to pull through despite the abysmal fate of its toyline, though I loath the comparison).
It would help too if they advertised it a little more. How can you have a new episode and not have previews for it??? Episode 18 had none! Back in the day, when I watched Sailormoon they didn't have previews but they advertised several times around 4-7 pm when they knew kids were on TV.
It's nice to hear from someone involved in the show about the show's situation. It's also really nice to know that the move to Saturday mornings is actually a positive, rather than the negative I was expecting. The franchise still needs to proove itself in the modern market place, so some skepticism is expected. I just wish CN would handle things better for once in it's life...
Would be nice to know that it was showing in other countries, but that situation could be the way it is because of contract issues, or something along those lines. I don't feel we know enough about that situation to sight that as a bad decision on their part just yet.
My biggest problem with the way the show has been handled so far, is the fact that CN hasn't bothered to re-air the episodes (beyond the first two/three episodes back in December before going to the loooong break, which has been another issue). We get two chances to watch a new episode, and that's it till the next new episode airs.
As for the poor sales of the toys, some better advertising and distribution would have been nice. All around more interesting product from Bandai would have been great. The switch to 8" to 6" Classics hasn't helped either. Bandai either needs to step-up their game, or hand it off to another company. Though honestly, I'm not sure I can think of a toy company that wouldn't have botched the line in one way or another...
I'll definitely continue to support the show by watching it on Saturday mornings, legally. Can't say I'll be buying any more product in the near future. Maybe once Bandai shows some confidence in their line.
The reason why Thundercats is as big as it is IS & ALWAYS will be due to the original. I had always felt that if they were to do a new series they should simply pick up where TOS left off. After all, it's those classic characters that have amassed legendary status in the world of pop culture. This whole "re envisioning" of the NS has not worked out as well as they thought. Sure, modernize it a bit, but you don't go changing the recipe that's been working for more then two decades. All I have to say is look at Panthro. He honestly bears no resemblance to the original that everyone, even people who never watched TOS, know and love. Big mistake IMO.
The reason why Thundercats is as big as it is IS & ALWAYS will be due to the original. I had always felt that if they were to do a new series they should simply pick up where TOS left off. After all, it's those classic characters that have amassed legendary status in the world of pop culture. This whole "re envisioning" of the NS has not worked out as well as they thought. Sure, modernize it a bit, but you don't go changing the recipe that's been working for more then two decades. All I have to say is look at Panthro. He honestly bears no resemblance to the original that everyone, even people who never watched TOS, know and love. Big mistake IMO.
For the most part, Thundercats had a very clean slate to work with. they had a small group of "hardcore fans" a larger amount of "casual" fans and a near infinite number of people who never even heard of Thundercats. And the casual fans remember three very specific things about Thundercats...The theme song/opening cinematic, the main characters and the fact that they were naked in the first episode. What WB was really aiming for were the kids who had no idea about the brand and casual fans who just remember the Thundercats existed. That was where the money was to be made. Going for the "hardcore" fan market is a sure fired way to lose money.
But the problem is, WB cocked it up. Bandai was just not up to the task of keeping shelves fresh, or even selling the lien to retailers adequately. Cartoon Network and WB were on different pages about the show. CN had two significant airing breaks that killed the initial momentum of the show. And it was never marketed correctly at all.
Skeleton Warriors apparently made the same mistake with the toys. Not enough good guys in the first wave.
Skeleton Warriors apparently made the same mistake with the toys. Not enough good guys in the first wave.
Quote: "they don't even produce enough villain toys to go against the Cats."
I agree, the toy line would have been much more appealing with a larger variety of characters which included more villains. When I was a kid, I would be interested in a toy line if it had a wide range of characters available that I liked the look of. I wouldn't necessarily have to have seen the tv show either. I always thought "bad guy" figures looked bad ass. When LJN did the thundercats toy line, I remember more or less every character being available. I think the waves were larger. If only Bandai were doing the same with the 6" figures. I wish that the main line had just been 6" figures (both modern and classic), that way there would be more characters available by now in 6" scale. If the vehicles and playsets had been for 6" figures, the quality might have been better.
Agreed 100%
For the most part, Thundercats had a very clean slate to work with. they had a small group of "hardcore fans" a larger amount of "casual" fans and a near infinite number of people who never even heard of Thundercats. And the casual fans remember three very specific things about Thundercats...The theme song/opening cinematic, the main characters and the fact that they were naked in the first episode. What WB was really aiming for were the kids who had no idea about the brand and casual fans who just remember the Thundercats existed. That was where the money was to be made. Going for the "hardcore" fan market is a sure fired way to lose money.
But the problem is, WB cocked it up. Bandai was just not up to the task of keeping shelves fresh, or even selling the lien to retailers adequately. Cartoon Network and WB were on different pages about the show. CN had two significant airing breaks that killed the initial momentum of the show. And it was never marketed correctly at all.
I guess what I meant was that the nostalgia of the OS and subsequent re-airing of it on Toonami kept Thundercats relevant in pop culture with no new material for a very long time. I think that says a lot about those characters.
Could they have written a series that "started" where the OS left off that would appeal to both people new to Tcats and those familiar with the OS? I believe so. That's what flashbacks are for after all
It may have even had those new to Thundercats picking up the OS on DVD to "catch up".
They ordered 26 more episodes apparently, so that's a good sign.
And there were toy commercials, by the way. They were on around October last year. There was a commercial for the 4" line, and the Thundertank and Tower of Omens.
Most toy lines don't have commercials these days anyway, except during the holidays.
I guess what I meant was that the nostalgia of the OS and subsequent re-airing of it on Toonami kept Thundercats relevant in pop culture with no new material for a very long time. I think that says a lot about those characters.
Could they have written a series that "started" where the OS left off that would appeal to both people new to Tcats and those familiar with the OS? I believe so. That's what flashbacks are for after all
It may have even had those new to Thundercats picking up the OS on DVD to "catch up".
It didn't keep it relevant, it didn't bring anything back.
I think you're looking at it through some very thick nostalgia glasses.
And sure, it definitely reminded people like me who hadn't seen the show since my youth of just how awesome the OS was / is, but the show surely procured new fans during its airing on Toonami who had never seen it before.
I've been online since about 1994. At that time there was almost nothing on the internet with regards to Thundercats. In 95 or so there were the first few rumblings / sites, and then in 97, the year it came back on Toonami was when people really started talking about it (I'm sure a few were inspired by having been "reacquainted" with the show), and suddenly it seemed like everyone wanted to start collecting Thundercats (myself included). And from there it just kept on going / growing.
Would it have happened regardless of the show coming back on Toonami? Sure. But maybe not as quickly, who knows? That really is something that would be stupid to debate but I think the show airing on Toonami did a lot of good for the franchise.
Here are the things I am referring to that WB simply dropped the ball on. Please keep in mind, WB has a fantastic repertoire of subsidiaries at their disposal. Cartoon Network and DC Comics are both owned by Warner Bros. So please keep that info in mind when reading below.
1. Where's the promotion?
From the get go, Warner Bros. has taken the absolute bare bones promotion route for Thundercats. They had fairly small Con presences prior to the show airing and nearly non-existent ones after the show aired.
2. Allowed Cartoon Network to kill the show momentum
As stated above, Cartoon Network is owned by WB. So there's no excuses to allow them to dictate how the show airs. WB, if they so choose, has all the power there. Also, how could they allow two very extended hiatuses for a show that's still finding it's footing in the modern market?
3. Where are the licensees?
WB owns DC Comics. Let that sink in...They own one of the top 2 comic publishing companies in the world. Where in the hell is a Thundercats tie-in and/or classic comic? also, why have they not sought out the plethora of other licensees out there? Both modern and classic clothing should be in every major retailer. Where are the school supplies? Where the hell are the console video games and mobile apps?
4. Bandai
Bandai has proven to be the worst possible company to get this toy license. They've dicked around with the collectors style figures, put out some rather questionable sizes for the smaller modern era figures and have dropped the QC ball on more than 1 item. That is not even getting into them screwing up getting the toys into all the major retailers and the massive distribution problems they seem to be having right now.
5. Web Presence
The official WB Thundercats Facebook Page has a ton of fans. They have well over 1 million "likes". Yet the place is a barren waste land when it comes to WB using it. They have very little interaction with the fans there. They only spit out the same PR crap that I get in my emails (which have becomes much less frequent). Also, getting things in a timely manner is a joke from their PR department. They don't send out the clips and pics to everyone at once. They had different people sending them to different sites. Now they send the clips out like 14 hours before the episode airs...If at all. Since the show has come back, they have had clips for only 2 of the four episodes.
6. Advertising
Why are there no commercials for the toys during the airing of the episode? Why am I not seeing cartoons for the show during all their other shows that share a crossover audience? Why am I not seeing commercials at all on other networks? For comparison, I see Transformers: Prime cartoon commercials while watching Comedy Central, FX, etc.
7. Failed at getting the 80's fans
Thundercats is most recognizable by people who are currently in their 30's and 40's. The hardcore fans already where following the shows progress, looking for the toys and chatting it up daily. These are you guys (and you guys freakin' rock). However, the casual 80's fan. The ones who simply just remember that Thundercats existed, what they were and that they were awesome. These guys were never catered to. They never went out of their way to catch the attention of these guys. This ties into all of the things above such as Licensing, promotion, web presence, advertising, toys. They don't know or don't care because there is no comic, there is little to no apparel, no cool non-toy items (like school supplies, mouse pads, coffee mugs, etc.) and they aren't seeing the brand being pushed in any way.
Those are my issues with how WB has handled this. Some of these things can be fixed quickly, but building up a new head of steam is going to take a concerted effort on their part. You'll notice I didn't say anythign about the show itself. That's because, even though it has a few bumps here and there, the show is great. The hand drawn animation on display is some of the best on TV. It has fantastic voice acting and a diverse set of interesting characters. If given a few seasons to develop, the show has the potential to become something pretty special.
There's like 1 shirt on Hot Topic's website, my TRU can't seem to get rid of the toys (cause they're buried in between the Phineas & Ferb and leftover Ben10 stuff), a comic is due later in the year/next year, and a DS game is forthcoming.
See, if this stuff had been out AHEAD of the show or at elast in time for season 1, we'd be talking about every scrap os season 2 rumor we could get, not discussing how WB & CN & Bandai have royally screwed things up.
Sadly, this reminds me of a few years back, when Mattel failed to get the Snake Men He-Man toys to stores, so their failure to sell conivnced Mattel to cancel the 2003 remake of He-Man, which I felt was a HUGE disservice to fans. In fact, if anyone from WB were to read this, I'd say they need to consider changing licenses over to someone else who knows how to promote stuff, not whoever gives them the best deal.
See, if this stuff had been out AHEAD of the show or at elast in time for season 1, we'd be talking about every scrap os season 2 rumor we could get, not discussing how WB & CN & Bandai have royally screwed things up.
Sadly, this reminds me of a few years back, when Mattel failed to get the Snake Men He-Man toys to stores, so their failure to sell conivnced Mattel to cancel the 2003 remake of He-Man, which I felt was a HUGE disservice to fans. In fact, if anyone from WB were to read this, I'd say they need to consider changing licenses over to someone else who knows how to promote stuff, not whoever gives them the best deal.
I see the DS game as a complete cop out by Namco Bandai.
Rankin Bass & LJN had a certain synergy which WB and Bandai have not been able to match sadly.
WB has always been lazy with the Thundercats license. When WB acquired it from Rankin Bass there was a huge problem where Rankin claimed WB underpaid them for one. Then they release that crappy first DVD set where the soundtrack is completely missing from episode two. How the hell do you miss that?? Yeah they corrected it by offering the replacement disc but I believe that right there was a sign of things to come.
Anyway, the toys don't sell because Bandai has done nothing to advertise them. Bandai only releases them because they were given the license, but they don't give a damn about it. If they cared, they would take pride in the line and try to sell it like crazy. Plus, in order to get the toys to sell, you have to release new figures every 3 months, NOT do figures, 6 months later release a couple more, and then nothing for 8 months.
Also, since when does a toy line need to sell for the show to continue? Johnny Test doesn't have a toyline and it is on CN 60 times a day. Samurai Jack and Transformers Animated had toylines and they were still canned.
With all the Warner properties they could make their own company like Hulu Plus which makes a monthly fee and an advertising fee of ads that can't be skipped. But instead they stay firmly cemented in the past while other companies find more ways to use the internet to get out their shows.
They ordered 26 more episodes apparently, so that's a good sign.
And there were toy commercials, by the way. They were on around October last year. There was a commercial for the 4" line, and the Thundertank and Tower of Omens.
Most toy lines don't have commercials these days anyway, except during the holidays.
I've only seen ads for the Thundertank and the Sword of Omens...and around here b4 Xmas there were large displays containing both toys...but the figures were only on pegs and not that many, I did manage to get a Tygra and Panthro, my faves, but now there's only a foot or so of peg/shelf space. Sad.
I've also noticed, at least on my cable system, that CN doesn't have nearly the shows On Demand that they used to ....and certainly not TC. I keep the episodes on my DVR and show them to my nephew, who's 7 and loves the series, but hadn't seen anything about it b4. So they need to cross advertise for sure, he watches the HUB, and Nick a lot...but somehow missed this series, so they're definitely not advertising like they should.
I don't think continuing where the OS left off would've been a good idea though. There are just too many kids who haven't seen the OS. and well just look at Voltron Force. They continued the story and it sucked.
Also WB might be CN's parent company, but that doesn't mean CN doesn't have it's on separate group of executives controlling the company. WB can't micromanage everything.
I don't think continuing where the OS left off would've been a good idea though. There are just too many kids who haven't seen the OS. and well just look at Voltron Force. They continued the story and it sucked.
Also WB might be CN's parent company, but that doesn't mean CN doesn't have it's on separate group of executives controlling the company. WB can't micromanage everything.
Lotor will be back, that is, if the series comes back.
Or maybe if Cartoon Network would stop letting George Lucas preempt every good show on CN with Clone Wars. Going to reruns as soon as eight episodes, when the whole season was already animated. Secondly, the confusion caused by Bandai and the classics line caused even hardcore fans to "Watch and Wait" instead of purchase. Eight Inch Tygra is on the dime store shelf with Stinky Pete because Bandai followed in the inequality footsteps of LJN. Really? Classic Mumm-Ra with NO SWORD OF PLUNDARR!
Ok I'm done venting now. Time to go buy an eight inch Tygra so they don't cancel my show.
Ok I'm done venting now. Time to go buy an eight inch Tygra so they don't cancel my show.
Honestly, I think the main problem is that kids just aren't connecting with it the way they had hoped. When all is said and done I don't think anyone can really say that Bandai didn't give it a solid effort. Sure there were missteps along the way but there was a lot of product for that first wave. Collectors ate that first wave up too but once they got their full, kids weren't there to pick up the slack.
Maybe this move to Saturday will change things. My local Target marked their Thundercats back up to full price last week. So maybe sales did spike some.